Posted by: Jim | October 25, 2006

Man, oh Man

Talk about “view changing.”

I’m trying hard to dialog with Conservatives. Laura is awesome, and I like her. But the people I’m encountering over at “Venomous Kate’s” blog are cementing the footprint of the stereotypical “kill-em-all” Republicans who cannot back up their opinions with cogent facts, and instead resort to personal attacks on my character. These types of people give our enemies a chance to condemn us.

Have most Americans lost the ability to dialog? To think rationally? Or are these most-outspoken people on the internet a skewed representation? Are all the thinkers avoiding internet dialog? (Now there’s a thought.)



  1. Thanks very much for the compliment and the link, both are appreciated.

    Sorry I haven’t had the time to join you here, as I’m barely keeping up with my blog right now due to a major work crunch, but I’ve been peeking in here from time to time.

    I suspect that while there are what you perceive as “stereotypical” Republicans out there, just as there are those I think of as stereotypical Democrats (i.e., the shrieking, cussing Democratic Underground types, grin), there are plenty of bloggers who would be willing to exchange ideas, it’s just a matter of persistence. 🙂

    I think also that a lot of the ‘Net “dialogue” goes on not so much on a one-to-one basis, but blog to blog or party to party. For instance, the Democrats say or do something, the Republican bloggers respond. And vice versa.

    As the saying goes, some of my best friends are liberals (grin). I don’t pull any punches when it comes to stating what I believe — including who or what I believe is wrong — after all, that’s what a blog is for, right? But at the same time I think it’s possible to discuss strongly held convictions while maintaining one’s manners, and doing so makes it more likely that one can “win friends and influence people.” It’s always good to find others who feel the same way.

    Best wishes, Laura

  2. this thinker retired.

    i don’t think there is much scope for political debate left in America with people on the other side of the divide. and to equate people on the left with those on the right, i just don’t think it can be done. look at what Bill O’Reilly has been saying, with no evidence, about Michael J Fox this week. he is just one nutjob, but what is damning about his words are that he knows that his constituency of right-wingers will support such behaviour. the same goes for Drudge and Limbaugh and other heroes of the right. they are able to spout utter lies, and why, because if it furthers their “politics” then anything goes. where are the figures on the left who could retain their audience spouting such vile trash, or avoid censure from their superiors?

    the way this filters down into the “debate” that blogging conservatives typically engage in – avoid any unwelcome facts, destroy the reputation of anyone who disagrees (even if they were previously (especially if they were) a loyal conservative), drag out supposed parallels on the Democratic side, regardless of when they happened in the last 200 years, etc, what hope is there? when was the last time a conservative admitted a mistake? i mean, the Leader himself, King Bush, years into a war that’s an utter disaster for his country and the generations to come, he can’t think of any mistakes he’s made!

    the right-wing thing is a fractal, self-similarity at every level as conservatives copy one another’s smearing tactics and normalise the worst kind of behaviour. add in the fact that an absolute state of denial is in effect, and what do you get. i know conservatives are going to hate to hear this again – but Bush IS a terrible president, War in Iraq WAS a mistake, the economy IS a shambles, Naked republican corruption IS endemic, crony federal appointments DID cost thousands of lives in New Orleans, and the unauthorized wiretapping IS Unlawful, etc

    bring me the conservative who accepts those facts, or who can offer a point-by-point defence that doesn’t include vitriol and quotes from Right-Wing Nutjobs, and i will debate them.

  3. may i say one last thing, too. i am not discrediting the values of conservative thought here, but the point is, the present Republican party simply does not adhere to those values. they betray those values with their actions. i have plenty of time for fiscal conservatives with a libertarian streak, who don’t care what people do in their personal lives (and actually believe people have a right to a personal life, not having senators intervene a la Schiavo, or Bush wiretapping them), but this alliance with “values voters” and the increased impinging on the right to live as you please, it is damaging.

    and what happened to govt you can drown in a bathtub when these spending-crazy people came along? the biggest damn deficit ever, the US in hock to China. but any criticism is what? crazy talk? giving props to Al Qaida? do me a favour!

  4. I’ll let you in on a (not-so-big) secret: they drive me nuts, too. That’s why I had to conclude one entry not long ago with a warning that anyone pulling the “kill ’em all” stance was going to get booted.

    I suppose I could do that more often, but sometimes I’d rather just sit on my side of the computer and laugh at them.

  5. I predict that the Libertarians will start doing so well in elections in the next 10 years, that they will become a real threat to the Republicrats and Demicans. Many people I know are sick of both parties, but like me still vote mostly Republican because it’s rare when the Dem’s can put up a canidate that’s not a socialist hack. Does anybody REALLY want Pelosi as the Speaker of the House?
    Not me, brothers and sisters.

  6. Venjanz, I was a Libertarian for 12 years before realizing (at the time) that they were mostly extremely kooky folks with extremely good ideas.

    I’m not aligned 100% anymore with the Libertarians, but still think that a lot of their ideas are what *true* conservatives should be.

    If they can find some decent candidates, they might get my vote once again.

  7. Yeah, I was never a member either but I still donate money to them. I used to post on the message boards until I realized that most of these people only had one ajenda: Legalize pot. At least 1/2 of all the posts had something to do with legalizing the chronic. I think they will be a force in the future, but they need more… direction I guess.

  8. so you can own body-armor piercing bullets but aren’t free to smoke a blunt? i don’t see why personal freedoms should be unevenly applied. i like the libertarian strand of thought because it is something uniquely American, with no counterpart in the politics of where I am from (England), outside of a few pink aristocrats from two centuries ago who fought to have their sex lives legalised.

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